I guess were all here for the same reason, to have a bit of a whine about Orange problems.
I've just about reached the end of my teather with them. I've been a Freeserve Customer since the start - got the disk from Dixons way back in the day. In 1999 I signed up to Broadband, and I haven't saw the need to change provider since that time - until now.
My package details are:
Broadband Max - @ £17.99 per month
In april I received a letter starting with " Dear Mr Allison, were really pleased your enjoying using broadband with Orange"
"you'll remember, however that when you joined up there is a fair usage policy in place. Your average monthly allowance between january and feburary was 61GB. Which is more than the fair usage limit.
It goes on for a bit then says "We would really appreciate it if you could lower your usage, especially within peak hours 6PM-Midnight. in line with terms and condition. The alternative is that we might have to cap yoru connection speed so other customers don't suffer.
Fair enough I thought. I had done some excessive downloading in that month. The next month I made a concious effort to lower my usage and by count of my rotuer it shown that i had only downloaded 6GB in the next month.
However, at the start of this month I noticed my connection rate suddenly drop within "peak hours" to 512K. I've tested this on various speed test websites and it's always the same. Yet one minute past midnight and the connection shoots away back up to full spead. (5.5MEG is the fastest my line will do).
So I know, without a doubt they are capping my speed, and they didn't even have the decency to inform me.
I've phoned them several times now, got hung up on, transfered to more departments and agents than I can remember and they acomplish NOTHING. I'm never rude to agents on the phone, i respect they are just doing their job as I've worked in similar roles in the past. But I am also a Certified Network engineer as well as a Microsoft Certified Systems Expert - I'm not saying this to try and sound superior, but the fact is that the blokes on the phone are reading off a script and they haven't asked any question that makes a single bit of sense yet.
I'm so fed up of calling them and getting nowhere, I finally blew my top last night and sent an e-mail to their customer support page - here is the transcript.
___________
Quote:
Your question is about: Broadband
> Description of query: null
>
> Please enter your name: Andrew ********
> Please enter the email address we should reply to: ***********
>
> Wanadoo / Orange username: ********************
> Contact telephone number: 0141***********
>
> What Operating System are you using: winvista
>
> Question or details of problem:
>
> BROADBAND SPEED.
>
> Hello, I am currently paying for 8MEG broadband, I accept and understand
> fully that the line i have can only cope with 5.5Mbps.
>
> In this case I am finding that my connection is only getting 512Kbps
> download speed MAXIMUM.
>
> I recently received a letter from Orange saying that I had exceded the
> data ammounts set out in the 'fair usage policy'. Since this time my
> internet speed has seemed to drop from a reliable 5MEG to this pathetic
> 512Kbps connection. I would like to know if my connection is being
> limited/restricted at your end, in which case I would want to cancel my
> contract.
>
> I'm not going to phone up technical support, because the last time I did
> this I spent Three hours over the course of 3 days and got told
> absolutly nothing I didn't know already. This time includes being
> transfered around to dead numbers, and hung up on several times, being
> endlessly transfered from 1st - 2nd line.
>
> I am a Comptia certified Network Technician and Microsoft certified
> systems expert, Having some nice, but obviously clueless person taking
> me through scripts for an hour at a time does not help the situation.
>
> On the advice of your 'technician' I was advised to contact BT to have a
> line test performed - no fault was found, and I also encurred a charge
> for checking the internal house wiring.
>
> To answer a few basic, technical questions:
>
> I have used the livebox - the speed maxes out at half a meg when testing
> against any speedtest website. (speedtest.net etc)
>
> I have tried two additional routers with more advanced operating system
> which allows me to run tests which indice a maximum speed to half a meg.
>
>
>
> I am acccessing the internet via several diffrent machines on my home
> network.
>
> My Line has been fully tested by BT - no fault was found on the line.
>
> The Internal wiring in my house has been tested by a BT at my own cost.
> - no fault found.
>
> ADSL microfilters have been replaced - no change.
>
> The router is connected directly to the master socket, I have tested
> this with nothing else attached at all, and even connected straight to
> the BT test socket - still same.
>
> I would appreciate some urgent action with regard to this as I am
> rapidly running out of patience and do not plan to incur any more costs
> as a result of the poor service i have received.
________________________
The Reply I received EXACTLTY 24 hours later was this, obviously automated message. (which also shows their customer SLA is to respond within 24 HOURS)
_________________________
Quote:
Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 23:55:57 +0100
> To: ***@*********.com
> Subject: Re: Email from Help (KMM************)
> From: customer-service@uk.orange.com
>
> Hello Andrew,
>
> Thank you for your email.
>
> We understand your concern.
>
> Please note that we always respect the privacy of your personal
> information but we do need to undertake some quick security checks for
> reasons under the Data Protection Act (DPA).
>
> Please provide the following pieces of information to give you account
> details.
>
> 1) Your full name (name given at the time of registration)
> 2) Your date of birth
> 3) Your full address with postcode
> 4) 1st and 3rd characters of your password
> 5) Account number
>
> As soon as we hear back from you we can sort your problem out.
>
> If you have any further queries then please do not hesitate to get in
> contact with us again.
>
> Kind Regards,
> Manish
>
> Broadband Support
> REF:WOOBB
>
> Technical Support - Broadband customers: 0844 873 8586
> Opening Hours -
> Starter and Broadband Technical Support: 24 hours a day, 7 days a week
> Wireless & Talk and MAC Technical Support: 8am-11pm, 7 days a week
> Calls to this 0844 number are charged at 5p a minute from a BT landline,
> Orange Home Phone or your second phone line (if you have one). Calls
> from mobiles and some other networks may cost more. Calls may be
> recorded for quality assurance purposes.
_____________________________________
ARGH - By this time I had blew my top... and wrote this back
_________________________________________
Quote:
Name: Andrew A*****
DOB **********
Address: ************
*********
**********
Password letters : **********
Account - ***********
Firstly I would like to say thank you for the response, however one feels that if such information is required then perhaps it should be on the contact information form?
Instead once again you have wasted another 24 hours (24 hours to the minute I may add) and continue the Orange notion of customer service by wasting yet more of my time by asking for the same information over and over again.
You had the e-mail address and I'm certain you could have found the account number with that. This information after all is sufficient for logging me on to the Orange member centre where all this other information is already held.
This is not a scenario where I want further technical support, I KNOW the speed is being capped during peak hours - in fact I did two tests tonight, one at 11:59 and one at 00:00 - guess what? Before 00:00 download speed was EXACTLY 512K, after, it shot away up to 5.5Meg.
I am paying for an unlimited service, and this was what was stipulated to the sales rep when I called up and re-newed broadband with Orange, either that agent was a liar, and miss-sold me this package, or Orange are not providing the service that was agreed.
I've already had a letter from you saying that you would "really appreciate it if you could lower your usage, especially within the peak times (6PM - midnight)" "the other alternative is that we might have to cap your connection speed so the other customers don't suffer" - After this letter, my usage WAS lowered, but you went ahead and capped my connection speed anyway – WITHOUT TELLING ME.
I don't want you to contact me with further troubleshooting, I want you to escalate my case and JUST FIX IT. Either that or call me and give me my MAC code.
____________________
THE REPLY to this????
___________________________
Quote:
Hi, This is an automatic reply to your email, please do not reply to this email. Thanks for getting in touch. We've passed your query to one of our advisors and they'll reply to you as soon as possible. If you do have any other questions about your service with us, don't forget to take a look at our Help area at http://help.orange.co.uk We'll get back to you as soon as we can.
EDIT by Admin: Personal information removed for security reasons
_________________ Freeserve/Wanadoo/Orange Customer since 1999.
Hello Andrew, Thank you for your email. Before we discuss any account information we need undertake some quick security checks to ensure that we are speaking to the account holder. We would request you to provide us with your full name or nick name or short name which you are called by at the time of registeration. If you have any further queries then please do not hesitate to get in contact with us again. Kind Regards,NeilBroadband SupportREF:*****
ARE THEY JOKING?
MY RESPONSE: (excuse the caps I was REALLY annoyed)
Quote:
This is ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS
DID YOU EVEN READ THE PREVIOUS E-MAIL ???? WE ALREADY DID THIS. READ THE MESSAGE MY FULL NAME IS CLEARLY WRITTEN AS THE FIRST THING ON IT. GEE I WONDER WHAT NICKNAME SOMEONE CALLED ANDREW COULD POSSIBLY HAVE? ANDY MAYBE? IF THIS IS SECURITY QUESTION THIS IS ABSOLUTELY PATHETIC.
ENOUGH OF THIS NONSENSE. HAVE YOUR MANAGER CONTACT ME OR THIS IS GOING TO WATCHDOG, OFFCOM & ISPA.
Not sure if anyone is interested (judging by lack of replies, but here is the latest updates in my ongoing contact with Orange.)
Quote:
> Hello Andrew,> > Thank you for your email.> > We are sorry to hear that you have chosen to leave Orange.> > To resolve your slow speed issue, we would require to perform a few > diagnostics and a line test to check the line from our end even though > BT has done the necessary line checks.> > Please provide us a convenient timeframe , for our Orange technical > team to get in touch with you for a line test.> > We have escalated your MAC Code request to the concerned team and the > same will be generated within 5 working days.> > If you wish to cancel your Broadband account, we would like to inform > that if you are within your 12-month or 18-month contract you can > cancel at any time but are liable for the remainder of that contract > and if you are outside your 12-month or 18-month contract then you can > cancel without any fees however you will have to give 30 days > cancellation notice. > > If you are changing Internet Provider, we advise you to follow the link > below for more information on MAC(Migration Authorisation Code) : > > http://help.orange.co.uk/orang...Mode=1> > > > If you have any further queries then please do not hesitate to get in > contact with us again.> > Kind Regards,> Gillian> > Broadband Support> REF:*****
My reply to this rubbish was
Quote:
Again, not a single hint you or anyone who has replied so far has actually read any of the message. I dont WANT to leave Orange, I WANT you to remove the speed CAP that hasbeen put on my connection during peak hours. I have asked for this to be escalated to a manger, but obviously this request has been ignored too. I don't need to arrange a time for a line test because this isn't nessecary. THERE IS NO PROBLEM WITH THE LINE. THE PROBLEM IS THE CAP THAT HAS BEEN PLACED ON MY CONNECTION BY Orange. Send me my MAC code and I will switch to an ISP that actually cares about it's customers. I have been with freeserve/wanadoo/orange since 1999. During this time I have had NO ISSUES with SPEED, or CAPS. I'm sure I'm still within my 12 month contract but we'll see how well that stands up when I cancel the direct debit and report this to watchdog. I will expect my MAC code in 5 days. Andrew Allison
And FINALLY SOMEONE ADMITS THERE IS "END USER SPEED CONTROL" (SPEED RESTRICTING) on the connection. STILL - look how long it's taken to get them to even get on the same page as me.
Quote:
Hello Andrew, Thank you for your email. We understand your concern. As per our records we can see that there is 'End user speed control' (also known as EUSC) applied on your line. It is where a line speed restriction of 512kbps is applied to a customer's line during peak hours(6pm to 12am, 7 days a week). The objective is to reduce network pressure at peak times which will be forcing them to use a lower speed at peak times. This has now replaced all previous soft capping activity. We are targeting customers who are in breach of our fair usage policy, ie downloading over 40GB of data in the space of a month. This congests the network and heavily affects the performance of our Internet service for other broadband users especially at peak times. Please note that your usage will be frequently monitored and if you reduce there usage to within the Fair Usage Policy for about Three months, normal service will be restored to your line during peak times. Alternatively, we request you to contact our Broadband Customer Support Team on 0844 873 8586 (IVR Options 1,4, calls are charged at 4.89 Pence per minute flat rate, lines open between 7AM and 11PM, 7 days a week), who will assist you further with the details. If you have any further queries then please do not hesitate to get in contact with us again. Kind Regards,William Broadband SupportREF*******
_________________ Freeserve/Wanadoo/Orange Customer since 1999.
Finally thank you for admitting there is a problem. It's only taken Three hours on the phone and 6 E-mails to get you to admit as such.
Now, firstly let me say this is a huge inconvenience to myself and fiancee who works from home during Orange "peak hours". As it stands the service is USELESS to me, as I cannot surf the web at adequate speeds, stream video without constant buffering or download ANYTHING. Secondly, there was no confirmation letter that you would be applying this.
So the way I see it, here are the two options:
Remove the "end user speed control"
or send me my MAC code,
As I refuse to pay £17.99 per month for "8 MEG BROADBAND" that is only operating at 512Kbps for six hours of the working day.
Andrew Allison
and the final word from them...
Quote:
Hello Andrew, Thank you for your email. We understand the situation you are in and regret the inconvenience caused to you. We would like to inform you that before applying the restriction, we do send letters to the customers informing them about the restriction. If you exceed the download limit then you will not be charged for the extra usage however there would be a restriction applied on the line. The restriction targets customers only who are in breach of our fair usage policy, ie downloading over an average of 50GB of data across 2 months. This congests the network and heavily affects the performance of our Internet service for other broadband users; especially at peak times. Once this has been applied we will monitor usage (during peak and off-peak hours) for about Three months and if this is within the fair usage policy, their original connection speed will be restored. If the customer continues to be in breach of the fair usage policy for a second time, they will have restriction permanently added to their line For further assistance we would request you to contact our Broadband Customer Support Team on 0844 873 8586 (option 1 and 4, lines are open from 7AM to 11PM, seven days a week, calls charged 4.89p per minute) As a web based team we have limited access to the required tools to remove the restriction. If you have any further queries then please do not hesitate to get in contact with us again. Kind Regards Broadband SupportREF:****
_________________ Freeserve/Wanadoo/Orange Customer since 1999.
Well, gee thanks for all being so supportive guys.. I don't know what I'd have done without you all.
Here's the proof that Orange don't care at all about their customers, don't care about the quality of service they provide, all they care about is taking your money... AVOID...
_________________ Freeserve/Wanadoo/Orange Customer since 1999.
Hi there. Been away for the bank hols, sorry no one else stepped in.
Have you decided to go? If so good luck. If not, forget about emailing Orange, they'll just pull ya string. Call support and say you want to talk to a supervisor and have the issue escalated. Don't be fobbed off with anything else.
OH GAWD I JUST RE-NEWED MY CONTRACT ON Orange TO THE 8MB MAX PACAKGE FROM THE 2MEG STARTER PACKAGE BECAUSE OF THIS 512K EVENING CAPP, (WHICH Orange WONT EVEN ADMIT TO) THINKING THAT HAVING THE MAX PACKAGE WOULD FIX THE PROBLEM OR AT LEAST HAVE MY CAPPING TIME GO A BIT FASTER AT LIKE 1MB AT LEAST. BUT GOING BY YOUR EXPERIENCE HERE IT LOOKS LIKE IM GONNA STILL BE CAPPED AFTER MY LINE RENTAL TRANSFER DATE.
MY CONNECTION IS ALREADY SHOWING ITS CONNECTED AT 7.7 YET I STILL ONLY GET 512K SPEED IN THE EVENING AND 2MB DURING THE DAY!
WHY THE HELL ARE Orange DOING THIS WHEN WE ARE PAYING GOOD MONEY TO THEM? THEY HAD BETTER LIFT THIS UN-ADMITTED TO CAPP BY MY LINE RENTAL TRANSFER DAY OR IM WRITING TO OFFCOM AND GONNA DIS-RECOMMEND Orange TO EVERYONE AND GIVE THEM BAD REVIEWS EVERYWHERE IF THEY WON'T LET ME OUT MY CONTRACT.
I DONT UNDERSTAND IT, ORANGE WAS GOOD BEFORE, WHY DO THEY HAVE TO BECOME STINGY TIGHT CROOKS. DO THEY REALLY WANT TO BE HATED THIS MUCH BY ITS CUSTOMERS?
To see how bad Orange can get, see my thread on link below :
http://www.orangeproblems.co.u...php?t=5990
Take my advice and leave Orange, they are better providers out there that won't lie to you about what the problem is.
JUST RECEIVED MY <a href="http://www.maccodes.co.uk">MAC</a> CODE....
Well, gee thanks for all being so supportive guys.. I don't know what I'd have done without you all.
Here's the proof that <a href="http://www.maccodes.co.uk" target="MAC">Orange</a> don't care at all about their customers, don't care about the quality of service they provide, all they care about is taking your money... AVOID...
Andy, sorry you had all that trouble, and I hope you're doing better with your new supplier. I thought I would point out an inconsistency in what Orange Broadband Support told you over the space of 24 hours, i.e.
"We are targeting customers who are in breach of our fair usage policy, ie downloading over 40GB of data in the space of a month. from William of Orange Broadband Support" (seen in your post of 25 May 09).
"The restriction targets customers only who are in breach of our fair usage policy, ie downloading over an average of 50GB of data across 2 months. from "nobody" of Orange Broadband Support" (seen in your post of 26 May 09).
So, what IS fair usage under the terms of Orange's policy?
Is it:
40 GB per month?
25GB per month? (i.e. half of 50GB across 2 months)
If Orange themselves cannot agree what their Fair Usage quota is, then how is the customer to know how much he/she is allowed to download?
This is so typical of the way Broadband suppliers behave. The industry is not sufficiently regulated, it's like the Klondyke out there, with the guys in the black hats making the rules as they go along - rules to suit themselves, of course. [/list]
Joined: 28 Oct 2006Posts: 1Location: Mendlesham, Suffolk, UK
KarinJ wrote:
"The restriction targets customers only who are in breach of our fair usage policy, ie downloading over an average of 50GB of data across 2 months.
So, what IS fair usage under the terms of Orange's policy?
Is it:
40 GB per month?
25GB per month? (i.e. half of 50GB across 2 months)
If Orange themselves cannot agree what their Fair Usage quota is, then how is the customer to know how much he/she is allowed to download?
This is so typical of the way Broadband suppliers behave. The industry is not sufficiently regulated, it's like the Klondyke out there, with the guys in the black hats making the rules as they go along - rules to suit themselves, of course. [/list]
Thank feck I'm not the only one who experienced this bizarre contradiction!!
My story is very similar to that of the original poster here.
In September of 2009, I received a letter telling me that my average monthly usage at peak times between June & July of 2009 was 28.15GB, therefore more than their fair usage policy allowed. They asked me to lower this and threatened, in a polite way, to cap me if I didn't. So, I called them up, not believing that I had used this much. The rep I spoke to was pretty helpful for an Orange rep but when I asked what the limit to my unlimited service was, he told me the exact same thing as quoted above. Firstly it was 40-50GB per month, then it was 40-50GB over two months and then it was 25GB per month. Somewhat confused, I asked for a definitive answer and was told it was definitely 25GB per month.
So, I installed a bandwidth usage monitor on both the PC's in the house and found that for the subsequent two months, I was nowhere near 25GB per month. I never heard anything back from Orange, so assumed everything was OK. More fool me!
In February I received another letter. This one told me that 3 months ago (i.e. November) they had reduced my speed at peak times as my usage at peak times was above the fair use policy. They went on to tell me that they had some "great news" and after looking at my usage, they'd noticed a drop and they had restored my peak time speed. They finally warned me that repeat offending would result in a permanent cap.
Now the strange thing is, the NEVER told me they had capped me in the first place!! So I was straight on to them via the phone and the guy on the other end told me I hadn't been capped, even though I had a letter telling me that I had. He blamed a "system error", told me I wasn't capped, everything was fine, that the slow speeds I had been noticing may be a fault on the line and that, most importantly, my usage was well within the fair usage policy guidelines. Apart from being perplexed as to why I had received this letter, I put it down to the "system error" and carried on regardless. Until 2 weeks ago.
The third letter arrived. This one reminded me that they had recently lifted a cap (yes, that's right, the cap that apparently never existed and the cap I was never informed of) but I had breached the fair use policy again and that they now had no choice but to PERMANENTLY cap me to 512kbps at peak times. They told me my average monthly usage at peak times was 6.2GB. And that was pretty much it. As far as Orange are now concerned, I pay for the Home Ultra package but get prehistoric speeds at the time I go online the most. Like the rest of you, I work all day, get home about 6, have tea, sort the kids out and then turn the PC on, do a bit of surfing, listen to a bit of music via Spotify, occasionally watch a program on iPlayer, or a few videos on YouTube, manage my blog and pretty much all the usual stuff. I rarely download music, I have never downloaded a film, any big downloads I make are pretty rare (I do sound design work so occasionally download sample packs of approx. a few 100 MB) but that is it.
Yes, I have checked my router details and nobody is piggy backing my WiFi. I regularly scan my PC for viruses, spyware, adware and any other malware, coming up clean every time.
I have reinstalled a bandwidth monitor and will see what that picks up, although it won't be much because of this infernal speed restriction!!
So, I wrote a 3 page letter last week, detailing the entire ordeal and demanding the removal of the cap, an explanation as to why I was capped without being informed and asking for detailed evidence of all my activity to back up their claims. On Thursday, I received a phone call from Orange telling me that they had received my letter and would be replying in writing. I am looking forward to seeing what they have to say.
Sadly, I am reluctant to move to another supplier because I do have a very good deal with Orange. Because I have my mobile contract with them, I get the Home Ultra package (Unlimited 8MB (Ha!!!), line rental, VoIP line and unlimited free and international calls) all for £15pm. I have scoured the net for a better deal and cannot find one that comes close. So, I will give them every opportunity to rectify this to my satisfaction before I leave them. But leave them I will if they do not sort this out.
I do have to wonder though. If their "Unlimited" package is indeed limited by the Fair Usage Policy, then surely the fact they still brand it as such, even with the disclaimer, is wrong?
And if they are so concerned about people's usage, why not provide customers with monitoring tools that let you know not only how much you are using in total, but what apps and websites use what in terms of bandwidth. Better still, build the feature directly into the Livebox.
I'll tell you why they don't. Because it would make a complete mockery of their claims to be providing an "unlimited" service, when it is anything but.
To give an update, I found the answer to my broadband problems.
For quite a few months now, I have switched over to PlusNet (www.plus.net) on their 10gb package. I know from my Mcafee Traffic Monitor on my virus checker previously that I was only using up to 3gb a month, which is still the case, so I knew I would be well within the guidelines.
I also dont do massive downloads, like music or anything, I just do online gaming and also surfing, so I switched to the 10gb package.
It has been the best internet connection I have had. No lags, no packes loss, no peak time "traffic" problems, just a constant smooth connection.
Also their customers service is great, they sort any problems out straight away and you dont have to speak to an indian call centre with people reading scripts that dont really have any idea what they are talking about...sound familiar to some of you?
All these problems with "my filters", "my line", etc magically disappeared when I switched to PlusNet, I know, there must have been a magical elf that fixed them, Im sure thats what Orange would tell me.
If you are still with Orange, take my advice and switch provider. PlusNet's 10gb line is only £6.99 for first 3 months then £12.99 after, but the connection is much better. If having a smooth connection is a requirement for you i.e for online gaming, then PlusNet are a good bet.
Just dont believe the lies Orange tell you about a faulty line, your equipment, etc, etc, etc, switch provider and get a better connection!!
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