I had a bit of a tussle with Orange about their broadband package. They call it Unlimited but then attach a fair usage policy. Unlimited means to have no limits.
I discovered the fair usage policy revolves around 50gb up and download, so that is the limit of the unlimited package. I was told if this was exceeded you would be notified and then warned and potentially have your account closed.
I am interested if anyone has been warned,etc of exceeding this limit.
Hmm, having your account closed may night be such a bad thing, and they shouldnt carge you any cancellation fee's as they broke the contract / ended your service
Joined: 13 Aug 2006Posts: 1689Location: Marylebone Central London
The advertised UNLIMITED and FREE is to sign up as many people as possible and lock them in a 12 month contract without expert TS and CS as they know it attracts customers unfortunately people generally go for that if its their first experience of broadband and before you say anything the same goes for most of the larger ISP's its a disgrace but at least the MAC codes will be compulsary and free in february so ofcom are slowly getting there.
I learned my lesson i subscribed to a smaller ISP with free CS and TS and a 1 month contract why? because they dont need to lock you in for 12 months as they give you what they advertise a cap if you exceed it you pay per gig.
_________________ ex Freeserve/Wanadoo/Orange Blog
I am (was) on a Plus Max 'unlimited' account and exceeded the FUP. I got one warning letter followed by this eMail about a month later:
Quote:
Hello
We've had to close your broadband account.
Feel free to give us a call to talk it through on 0870 010 2462* or 0870 1900 672* if you're on our Broadband Starter package between 7am and 11pm, any day of the week. For free broadband customers with an Orange pay monthly contract, call 150 on your mobile phone for free or 07973 100150 lines are open 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. Call charges from other networks may vary.
Thanks.
Customer Support
The Customer Support supervisor was a complete waste of space as the job to disconnect had been sent to BT ysterday! I dramatically reduced my downloads, but as the letter arrived mid-month I must have exceeded the FUP for a second time.
Be warned - you will only get one warning followed by a knee-jerk reaction.
I'm off to Telewest where they have looked up the word 'unlimited' in the dictionary!
I have recieved a letter vis email yesterday (21st) which says ............
Hello
We've had to close your broadband account.
Feel free to give us a call to talk it through on 0870 010 2462* or 0870 1900 672* if you're on our Broadband Starter package between 7am and 11pm, any day of the week. For free broadband customers with an Orange pay monthly contract, call 150 on your mobile phone for free or 07973 100150 lines are open 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. Call charges from other networks may vary.
Thanks.
Customer Support
But my bb is still working.
Does this mean they will pull the plug without warning in the near future?
I have just read Orange's Broadband terms and conditions.
Nowhere does it say there is a limit for a broadband or even what it is.
it mentions in paragraph 4.10 that there is a limit of 1000 minutes each month for international calls for the talk service.
I think if Orange do not make it explicit in their terms & conditions of a limit on downloads and what it is it it very hard for them to justify closing your account.
I called them and was talking to a clueless customer inquiries man that could barely speak english and then he put me onto the superviser who told me they will be taking the cancellation fee of 84 quid(I nipped that one right in the bud with my internet banking account and cancelled the direct debit lol)
They said they can call it unlimited because most of their users dont go above 5-10 gig per month and there is usually no problem. I said they are probably breaking a false advertising law and theat I would go to Trading standards and she said "well you just do that" and then Hung up
cheeky b***h.
I was not even allowed to recieve a M.A.C code from them ans was told since its Christmas it will be about the 10th of Jan before my line is able to recieve another BB isp.
Are their any isp's that unlimited means unlimited? (I dont have cable in my area)
Ask them where in their terms and conditions it categorically states what the 'unlimited' limit is, I cannot find one. if there isn't one how can they enforce it?
What usage were you using and had you been warned previously?
Joined: 13 Aug 2006Posts: 1689Location: Marylebone Central London
As far as i know only AOL offer real unlimited but reports say that will change now the Carphone Warehouse has bought them.
I hope you get it sorted soon
_________________ ex Freeserve/Wanadoo/Orange Blog
If you're on either our unlimited or uncapped broadband service then our Fair Use Policy applies to you.
Why have one?
Well it's designed to make sure your broadband service is fast and reliable whenever you use it.
Some of our broadband customers use file sharing software and download large files like music and videos. This uses up lots of network capacity leaving less available for you. If they're doing this at peak times, it could mean that the speed of your broadband service will be affected.
Am I likely to be affected by the Fair Use Policy?
If you don't use file sharing software or download large files from the Internet it's unlikely you'll ever be affected by this policy. If you do, all we ask is that you do so considerately, perhaps by downloading outside the peak hours of 6pm to 11pm.
What will happen if my use is very high?
If you only occasionally have very high usage, we're unlikely to be concerned unless it becomes a regular occurrence. If this does happen then we'll get in touch to help you find ways to reduce your usage.
If your usage continues to be very high, we'll get in touch again. Ultimately, if your usage still remains excessive despite our attempts to help you reduce it, we may have to suspend your service and possibly close your account.
We don't want to do that, and with your support and goodwill we'll work with you to see if we can avoid this happening.
Last revised 14 February 2006
From a read of this I get
There is no real limit unless you download in peak hours . I time anything large for the off peak period and havent had any trouble .
Interesting to note that if they havent told you your using excessive bandwidth and tried to help you reduce it then they are going against their own policy which may give you some leeway .
These policies are carefully worded so that they can say any amount is deemed high . By not stating for example 50gb+ is high then they cant be pulled on it if they shut you down for 45gb usage .
Unlimited in broadband is about as helpful as Upto 8mb . Its ambiguous to give them wiggle room .
If you have been warned to reduce your use and ignored them or download at peak times then your on thin ice .
You tell us how much you download in gb per month and see if we think its excessive . The last time I saw someone get the emails from them he was downloading 1.5 terabytes a month which he thought was reasonable .
Personally anything over 60gb is what Id call excessive .
I was not even allowed to recieve a M.A.C code from them ans was told since its Christmas it will be about the 10th of Jan before my line is able to recieve another BB isp.
I asked about a MAC code and they said that as they are terminating my account I would have to wait until I was disconnected by BT and then would be able to apply to any other BB provider as a new customer.
I am fortunate to have cable so am going to Telewest who have assured me that they have no FUP and are truly unlimited - and much cheaper - I'm getting the same BB package as Orange + Cable TV for £5 less.
I am still on borrowed time as they have said that it can take up to 10 days for BT to disconnect my modem.
There is no real limit unless you download in peak hours . I time anything large for the off peak period and havent had any trouble .
Only stuff I've seen for this is pretty much after the fact and all we get to see are average usage, no mention of times at all.
Quote:
Interesting to note that if they havent told you your using excessive bandwidth and tried to help you reduce it then they are going against their own policy which may give you some leeway .
Possibly although by the time the "we're closing your account" message is sent it's usually too late and can't be stopped.
Quote:
These policies are carefully worded so that they can say any amount is deemed high . By not stating for example 50gb+ is high then they cant be pulled on it if they shut you down for 45gb usage .
Yes although the figure usually doesn't go down, only up, in my experience. For example last time I heard they were closing off a lot of heavy users it was over 40 gig, as the way the interent is currently changing I can only really see them moving it higher and higher.
Quote:
Unlimited in broadband is about as helpful as Upto 8mb . Its ambiguous to give them wiggle room .
Oh very! I've even seen mention of other uses of "unlimited" stated as referring to amount of time it can be used rather than the magic "data transfer" wording that you really need. Lots of people assume it refers to downloads when it's purposefully vague to give them leverage against heavy users.
I believe Orange, like most ISP's get charged for bandwith purely on usage and not on when it's used. If I'm wrong on that do let me know! That means it really only comes down to usage. Someone who downloads 60gig a month at peak times may effect other customers more than someone who downloads 60gig during the middle of the night but they're still going to have to pay the bandwidth costs either way. You can see the appeal for Orange here, get rid of the heavy users and reduce costs, improve the connection of other customers.
I saw a report recently that showed in terms of speed vs cost the price of broadband hadon average halved in the last 1-2 years and that during this time the associated costs of providing the services had gone down only a small fraction of that. So it's only natural that a lot of providers are trying to save money in some form or another.
Nowhere in Oranges fair usage policy does it state an amount for broadband, it only does for international calls on the talk service.
it is not easy for customers to know what is excessive in these days of working from home, streaming tv/football, Napster, etc. If Orange don't state an amount how are customers to know what to stay under. It must be hard to enforce if an amount is not stated anywhere.
I try to keep my high usage during off peak times, during the night or early morning. I have emailed Orange about their fair usage policy and my uasge but no reply as yet.
The guy who was downloading over a terabyte pasted the first warning email he got and I remember it saying "we have noted that last month you downloaded 1.5 Tb , This is considered heavy usage and is against our Fair usage policy" it then went on to inform him of further action if he didnt toe the line .
I find it hard to believe they would just shut off an account without a previous usage warning . To do that would be unfair as they have given the user no chance to rectify their usage .
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