Finally switched from Orange to Sky, bloody Livebox would only ever work from the test socket, my main desktop pc would not keep a wireless connection for longer than half an hour despite being only 5 feet away. Wouldn't even connect via ethernet at these times!
Netgear router from Sky was activated just over 48hrs ago and i've yet to have a dropped connection to either of my pc's or my Xbox 360 (all connected wirelessly).
Furthermore I can now use any of my 3 extensions in the house with no loss of speed or noticable SNR drops.
Am I sorry to see the sleek, modern Livebox go? What do you think?
Joined: 18 Oct 2007Posts: 5Location: Central Scotland
Hi,
Interesting cause my Livebox has been laying gathering dust since I first joined up with Orange in July! Mainly because of all the negative reports I've seen about in on here and elsewhere. More especially since I also have a Draytek 2800VG Router/Modem which I has presumed was a lot better than the average high street rubbish (d-link/belkin/linksys/netgear etc) until it developed a problem and I had to press gang the Livebox into service. Here's an extract of my e-mail I sent today to Draytek (the 2800VG is going back on an RMA today...)
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Sorry its so long but I hope you'll find it worth the read...
First a little bit about me so you'll know where I am coming from on this. I'm actually a Network Analyst and have been in the industry for 40+ years (currently with VM's Corporate Network Team) so, as you might appreciate, I'm kinda "pickey" over what I choose for my network at home.
I eventually purchased the 2800VG last year after personal recommendation from a colleague and also from my own research on the web because I had got fed up with the cheap netgear/belkin/d-link/linksys rubbish peddled on the highstreet (I've tried them all!!) which are all built down to a price rather than up to a spec. Don't get me wrong, some sort of worked after a fashion but never up to the standard that I am used to in my professional life. That's why I ended up trying the 2800VG, which I have to say, thus far anyway (apart from the current problem) has out performed the rest. Or has it? Read on to see why I put that caveat on the end there...
During this last 2 years of trying various products, I have been with 3 broadband providers. 1st there was Eclipse, then (because we got offered an employee deal) Virgin.NET (which became VirginMedia of course) and now I am with Orange on a Broadband Unlimited product. I have to say that Eclipse were pretty good during the time I used them (2005 thro' to the end of 2006) and after an initial datastream 2Mb product, I was migrated to the ipstream MaxDSL 8Mb product. It was about the end of 2006 when most ISPs started suffering from the dreaded "peak time platform congestion" problem and Eclipse was no exception sadly. So, when my employer came along and offered me the same thing at half the cost, how could I refuse?! To put where the 2800VG fits into the scheme of things, as you now know, I purchased it in October of 2006, so it's been with us with Eclipse, Virgin and since July, now with Orange.
In terms of my BT line, that has NEVER been in question for a number of reasons. Firstly, I have a friend & colleadue who works in BT's Edinburgh network centre <grin> and secondly, I am no more than between 700-800 yards away from the exchange here in Central Scotland so over the years, I have been able to "max out" my line and get the quality as high as it will go (physically) for carrying the MaxDSL product. Since getting the 2800VG, it has never failed to physically connect at around the 6-7Mb mark and latterly for the last few months it has been consistently at 7232000 on most days. The PPP connect has varied of course dependant on the ISPs platform after the DSLAM but again has been "reasonable" to average. Eclipse never managed to give me more than about 4.8Mb but it was at least consistent (still on a physical high 6's connection). Virgin actually improved that with a consistent PPP of 6.5Mb but the downside was that the peak time congestion on their core platform was actually worse than Eclipse...
So to the present day. In July I switched to Orange simply because I was getting fed up with the appalling 40-50Kbit throughput during the evenings with Virgin. Part of the deal with Orange was a free Livebox (Inventel) when I took the account but, after reading many negative reports about it on the web, it stayed in its box and I continued on with the 2800VG. I have to say that Orange performance has been pretty good actually with consistent high 5's PPP connect rates on a physicall of 7.something most of the time and the peak time congestion hasn't been anywhere near as bad as with Virgin either and since I got a good deal to switch, I've been quite pleased with the value for money aspect also. I'm one of those rarities in the industry who is reasonable happy with their broadband product! lol!
However and you just knew it was coming, since this locking up and rebooting problem started a couple of months ago (pre and post the v2.8 firmware update) we are now where we are and it is on its way back for a checkup. So, what was I to use in the meantime? (I work from home a lot so it is imperative I am connected 24hrs via VPN) I could have used my old d-link G604T but I thought, "what the heck, I'll try the Livebox first and if it's pants, I'll fall back to the d-link". Imagine my pleasant surprise when, not only did it work fine but I'm sorry to have to say that it outperforms the 2800VG into the bargain! This is worrying because, a) the 2800VG cost as near as dammit £200 whereas, b) the Livebox was free with the Orange contract, c) the Livebox also does VOIP via Livetalk and calls are free at all times to all "normal" UK landlines (not so for either Orbtalk or Draytel) and finally d) have a look at these figures...
ADSL firmware version : A2pBT009c1.d17d
Connection mode : G.DMT
Type : Fast
Noise margin (dB) : 8.8
Attenuation (dB) : 23.0
Attainable download rate (kbps) : 7840
ADSL status : Connected [0]
Downstream Upstream
Rate (kbps) 7808 448
Remember, this is the same physical line as connected to the 2800VG. I have never experienced such a high physical connection link to the DSLAM with the 2800VG (highest has been 7232kbps) which suggests to me that the 2800's modem and physical interface is inferior to the Livebox's. Finally, my network testing tools (I have a bandwidth monitor running every 10mins) show the PPP connection with a flat top trace at 6.4Mbps since connecting the Livebox up whereas the best I could manage with the 2800 was in the 5.3 - 5.4Mbps region over the last 7 days before the change.
So, to sum up, why have I forked out close to £200 for an inferior product when a "free" product (albeit tied to a contract) out performs it??
Anecdotally, I also own an Internet radio which connects wirelessly to the router and it would quite often "buffer" the content when connected to the 2800VG. So far, it hasn't done it once yet with the Livebox...
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As you can see, quite the opposite experience with a Livebox than yourself...
Joined: 12 Jun 2006Posts: 907Location: Weston-super-Mare, UK
Colin
My Livebox is fine to with speeds around 6000.
The only problem I have had with a Livebox is when lightning got it and it killed the free phone. Sorted out within 28 days when they replaced the Livebox.
As with most hardware of this type you can get good and bad boxes.
Generally if you have more than 1 router/modem you may as well check and see how well each works. There's no real harm in checking except with truely faulty hardware and in that case you'd at least then know so it can be replaced or disposed of.
To be fair, it worked ok with my laptop. But it was so picky about connecting to my phone line (which I always knew was ok), that I'm glad to wave it goodbye!
I'm sure if you've got a good one it will perform very well, my friend had an old Wanadoo livebox and never had a problem with it in 3 years.
At the end of the day its horses for courses.
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